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我聽講聖經正典既形成，係唔知咩會議先決定既，你有無聽過呀？ 另外，近年既底本學說嘗試解釋聖經既形成，都令到我好困擾。 | |
回覆 beebeechan 你知我鍾意用比喻。 「聖經正典既形成，係唔知咩會議先決定」 好比十大勁歌金曲....選邊十大, 當然由主辦單位TVB 或其委托音樂界猛人來定。 「近年既底本學說嘗試解釋聖經既形成」....即是研究金曲《今宵多珍重》作曲者是王福齡, 還是另有其人? 是兩件不同的事, 明白咗就唔困擾 | |
即係你同意聖經都係由人挑選出黎既？ | |
回覆 beebeechan 唔係人來挑選, 唔通係由天上掉本經下來咩 | |
日期： 你身為版主, 這裡論過甚麼你蒙查查咁 呢個果阿話題, 貼文有咩唔合邏輯地方, 一年前就講過: 猶太集中營中的救贖 #28 https://m.exchristian.hk/forum/index.php?action=thread&tid=14284&extra=&page=2 係你扮盲定係失咗憶 | |
唔係人來挑選, 唔通係由天上掉本經下來咩 既然由人揀既，咁啲文字有乜咁特別？ | |
係你扮盲定係失咗憶 你都識話我係版主，梗係日理萬機架啦，唔記得有乜出奇？ 陳版友主要提出以下疑點： 1. 沙勿略致函要求成立果阿宗教裁判所並非事實，如果有，理應致函教宗而非葡萄牙國王。 2. 果阿有很多人慶祝沙勿略紀念日，反證其惡行指控。 3. 果阿仍保存著歷史悠久的印度廟，證明宗教裁判所並非針對印度教徒。 回應： 1. - Neill 2004, p. 160: "By another route I have written to your highness of the great need there is in India for preachers... The second necessity which obtains in India, if those who live there are to be good Christians, is that your highness should institute the holy Inquisition; for there are many who live according to the law of Moses or the law of Muhammad without any fear of God or shame before men". - Rao, R.P (1963). Portuguese Rule in Goa: 1510-1961. Asia Publishing House, p.43. - "However, his actions in India were not without controversy, as he was involved with the establishment of the Goa Inquisition, which punished converts accused of continuing to practice Hinduism or other religions.", How did St. Francis Xavier shape Catholicism?, https://www.britannica.com/story ... r-shape-catholicism - "When Francis Xavier, the infamous missionary, demanded the setting up of the Goa Inquisition, a religious tribunal for suppression of heresy and punishment of heretics, things rapidly deteriorated for Jews, Hindus and others accused of being non-believers.", https://www.newindianexpress.com ... isition-809153.html 連大英百科全書網站都咁講，可信性相當高。至於為何要致函葡萄牙國王而非教宗，明顯係政教合一既壞榜樣啦，細路仔先要揀既啫，大人why not both? 2. 據印度2011年的人口普查，果阿基督教徒佔總人口27%。紀念的人都是天主教徒，仲實有不乏外地人前來朝聖啦，非教徒沒有任何理由紀念一個天主教「聖」人，也印證果阿現政府對待天主教及其信徒相當寬容。 3. 你列舉了一些寺廟，為何它們沒被毀，有以下原因： Tambdi Surla Temple: The temple survived untouched due to its remote location in a clearing deep in the forest at the foot of the Western Ghats which surround the site. Brahma temple in Carambolim: in 1541, the Portuguese ordered the demolition of a Brahman temple in Carambolim village, in the central Ilhas district. According to indigenous tradition, the villagers secretly moved the ruined temple’s relics to Satari, a location then outside the zone of Portuguese control (now a northeastern Goan district bordering Karnataka). The primary temple relic was a granite statue of Brahma, 1.5 meters high, flanked by images of the Hindu gods Saraswati and Savitri. This statue sustained significant damage, apparently having been subjected to zealous Portuguese iconoclasm (Pereira 2008, 224). https://journals.openedition.org/lerhistoria/8618 Shri Nageshi Maharudra Temple: This temple was unaffected by the religious persecution of Portuguese rulers in the 16th Century. This was because at that time Antruj of Ponda Mahal was not under the domain of the Portuguese power and this facilitated the migration of Saraswat deities like Shantadurga, Ganapati etc. to Antruj. Mangeshi Temple: This temple had its origins in Kushasthali Cortalim, a village in murmugao which fell to the invading Portuguese in 1543. In the year 1560, when the Portuguese started Christian conversions in mormugao taluka, the Saraswats of Kaundinya Gotra and Vatsa Gotra moved the Mangesh Linga from the original site at the Kushasthali or Cortalim on the banks of river Aghanashini (Zuari)(Sancoale) to its present location at Mangeshi in Priol village of Atrunja Taluka, which was then ruled by the Hindu kings of Sonde of Antruz Mahal (Ponda), to be more secure. Mahalakshmi temple: The temple was built in 1831 by Dhakji Dadaji, a Hindu merchant. https://mumbaicity.gov.in/tourist-place/mahalakshmi-temple/ | |
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In particular, one can point to specific Portuguese colonial methods in India: the systematic destruction of mosque and temple sites, often coopting these sacred spaces to build structures for Christian worship (Rossa 1997, 43-50; Pereira 2008, 224, 228, 264; Souza 2009, 45, 63); the strategic placement of churches, shrines, and chapels at visually prominent locations (Gomes 2011, 18-22; Rossa 1997, 47-48; Souza 2009, 64); the incorporation of decorative Hindu temple components into the fabric of churches and secular structures for reasons of asserting symbolic cultural and religious dominance (Dehejia 1997, 373-376; Carita 2009, 293-298; Shirodkar 1983, 145-147); and the establishment of an Inquisition tribunal to enforce Hindu converts’ adherence to Roman Catholic orthodoxy (1560-1812) (Saraiva 2001, 342-353; Lopes 1998; Gracias 1912). By the end of the seventeenth century, however, Portuguese authority in the Old Conquests had long since been consolidated, largely by the creation – through conversion and procreation over generations – of a loyal Christianized Indo-Portuguese population (Robinson 1998, 46; Mendonça 2002, 81-82). Though spreading Christianity remained an important component of expansion during the campaigns of the New Conquests, evangelical proselytizing no longer represented a fundamental life-and-death program to guarantee the survival of the colony (Disney 2009, v. 2, 200-204, 314-322; Souza 1985, 10-24; Robinson 1998, 10). https://journals.openedition.org/lerhistoria/8618 | |
陳版友仲認為有咩唔合邏輯，即管討論一下，我也希望我寫的文章經得起挑戰。 ... 它有胆就即管討論一下，我也希望它寫的文章經得起挑戰。 | |
https://christingoa.wordpress.com/ | |
1. 沙勿略致函 ... 「我也希望我寫的文章經得起挑戰。」 我就嚟挑你! 睇吓你點經得起。 我成日都話你分析歷史資料未到家， 只係搵你想睇到既字眼嚟抽水。 （１） 就以你拎嚟呢句： - Neill 2004, p. 160: "By another route I have written to your highness of the great need there is in India for preachers... The second necessity which obtains in India, if those who live there are to be good Christians, is that your highness should institute the holy Inquisition; for there are many who live according to the law of Moses or the law of Muhammad without any fear of God or shame before men". 沙勿略建議的宗教審裁， 是針對仍保持猶太教和回教的所謂基督徒 （因為當時話信基督領洗就有唔少著數， 但暗中就仍拜佢地既神）。 唔係針對， 逼當地印度教嚟信教喎。 就拎你用嚟做reference 既網文: https://www.newindianexpress.com ... isition-809153.html 裡面都有講到：  以你一向作風: 「只睇標題來抽水, 不讀內容」.....唔知你幾時先會醒番少少。 （２）大英百科全書無錯都係幾有權威， 可信既 之不過， 人地只係話： "However, his actions in India were not without controversy, as he was involved with the establishment of the Goa Inquisition, which punished converts accused of continuing to practice Hinduism or other religions.", 只係'involved'...你就吹到, 誇張到佢係主持人, 掌門, 幕後黑手, 外國勢力咁囉. 仲有呀,,,講明係punish converts accused of continuing to practice Hinduism or other religions... 唔係去審其他宗教既人啵 | |
2. 據印度2011年的人口普查，果阿基督教徒佔總人口27%。紀念的人都是天主教徒，仲實有不乏外地人前來朝聖啦，非教徒沒有任何理由紀念一個天主教「聖」人，也印證果阿現政府對待天主教及其信徒相當寬容。 呢段唔隱知你想翕乜春夏秋冬 | |
至於為何要致函葡萄牙國王而非教宗，明顯係政教合一既壞榜樣啦 用吓你嗰腦哩 1546年, 沙勿略還是一個修會的小小傳教士 (不講樞機主教, 連主教職銜都無) , 你估係今日咁揚名咩... 點解葡萄國王會聽一個寂寂無名既傳教士老點做野, 而唔係睇羅馬教宗既頭? 即係香港特首會聽呢到條leefeng 9翕話基督徒煽黑暴, 所以要禁基督教....而唔係聽北京亞爺既指示? | |
Mangeshi Temple: This temple had its origins in Kushasthali Cortalim, a village in murmugao which fell to the invading Portuguese in 1543. 你拎嚟既資料都講到明建廟的地方那是葡萄牙控制的。 建寺時, 在宗教審裁最盛時, 還可以興建印度廟??? 為甚麼果牙天主教會一方面要燒毀, 拆印度廟, 一方面又容許印度教徒建新寺廟? 屎料是經常都是邏輯犯駁的 | |
新增給抽水思考的: 沙勿略也曾到澳門傳教。 澳門同樣是葡萄牙殖民地, 歷史上就没有傳教士要強逼拜佛拜馬祖的澳門人信天主教這回事。 澳門1557年便成葡萄牙殖民地, 與果牙同時期。 為何同一批傳教士, 可以容忍澳門人拜佛, 拜媽祖... 卻不容忍果牙人拜印度神? 沙勿略的宗教審裁和傳教作風, 明顯不是針對, 要摧毀當地原信仰。 | |
果阿有心基督徒寫的： 果牙的歷史學者寫的: Inquisition horror or error? https://www.heraldgoa.in/Edit/Opinions/Inquisition-horror-or-error/162157 Misuse of History: The Inquisition https://www.heraldgoa.in/Edit/Opinions/Misuse-of-History-The-Inquisition/162483 GOA INQUISITION LIES- SHEFALI VAIDYA EXPOSED https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZUgBAA4cNU&ab_channel=GloryApologetics | |
既然由人揀既，咁啲文字有乜咁特別？ 因為呢啲文字係講天主既道理， 講人如何回到天父那裡 | |
回應 你呢啲屎料係咪咁準確先 你話間廟同個大神像係印度教徒秘密由Ilhas搬遷到現今 Ｓａｔａｒｉ 位置, 因為葡萄牙教士要拆廟咁講。(見圖)  不過, 事實是因為14世紀時, 受北方藩王的攻打而搬遷  https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/goa/a-temple-to-the-god-of-creation/articleshow/54384918.cms 那時葡萄牙人殖民統治都未嚟 你唔好成日執執埋埋啲網上廢料當寶哩 openedition.org......根本就是網上既內容農場...求其登啲野來吸注意和流量 | |
你都識話我係版主，梗係日理萬機架啦， 你係日理一基， 不過呢個基有時都搞到你幾頭痕 |
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